Tuesday, April 7, 2009

What makes you think the federal government can provide health care at a lower cost?

Everything they do turns into a money pit. Wouldnt the usual government waste cancel out any saving from removing profit from health care?

What have you seen the federal government do that gives you enough confidence in them to believe they can efficiently run health care for 300 million people?


christian children's fund can feed, clothe,educate and provide needed health care for an entire village for just pennies a day, the price of a cup of flavored latte.

why can't we do that without bankrupting the nation?

The government will NOT be able to provide health care more cost effectively, more efficiently or at a higher standard.

Government run healthcare will be a disaster.

If anyone doubts this prediction all they need to is take a close look at the government run debacle known as medicare and medicaid.

Medicare/medicaid is filled with fraud, corruption, ineptitude, mismanagement, high pricing, and inefficiency. It is a total disaster.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3257/is_n10_v46/ai_13413481

Given the breadth of the fraud and abuse statute, many details of the law have been left to the courts, which have interpreted the statute quite broadly.

http://www.hcpro.com/CCP-227198-862/Medicare-and-Medicaid-identified-as-highrisk-for-fraud-and-abuse.html

The Obama Administration is not proposing that the federal government provide health care. Your premise is based on misinformation. What is being proposed is government subsidized HEALTH INSURANCE which would be utilized just like private health insurance in order to pay private doctors and hospitals just like we do now. Why people keep arguing against something that is not being proposed is beyond me. It seems that so many are being frightened into irrational thought.

For the record, administrative costs for Medicare are 4% and for private insurers they are over 14%. That is one reason that government subsidized insurance would be cheaper.

There are 39 'developed' nations. 38 of them have some kind of govt.-administered universal health care plan, and they ALL pay less than we do for the same level of care, the same customer satisfaction, the same or better outcomes.

Even we have a system like that. Medicare. Medicare takes just as good care of you as commercial insurance, and has about the same outcomes. If we simply expanded Medicare to cover everyone in the country we'd save literally hundreds of billions of dollars a year. The Fed. Govt. runs that and they do a pretty good job. There is -some- waste and fraud, but not nearly as much as in commercial insurance.

Obama thinks the Nationalizing Health care will help America however in reality the government will get to chose what kind of medicine you will get by how expensive it is, Imagine being able to afford a medicine that might save your life and the government say no you cant have it. Also with nationalizing health care you need something to pay for the "free health care" and that’s where the tax increase comes in and guess what, we will be paying for it.

They already provide health care for congress and federal workers, veterans and the elderly. Why not have all americans be part of the same group? Right now, insurance companies are profiting from all of us.

The federal government provides a military, a monetary system, an interstate highway system - what makes you think they can't do health insurance? Other countries do it, so can we.

Government can't, we lost a young lady in a skiing accident in Canada a few days ago because of government run health care. We have more brain surgeons in the state of California than all of Canada. Had she went skiing in California she most likely would be alive today.

Government run health care will push our best and brightest health care providers to Mexico, where they'll continue to live the lifestyle they're accustom.

I don't think Universal Health Care is the answer. I don't want some little pip squeak bureaucrat in Washington telling me when I can see a doctor, what doctor I can see and what medications he can order for me. But worse yet I really don't want the tax rate hike that would have to be put in place to pay for it. The federal government does only one thing well and that is waste too many of my tax dollars.

i am as skeptical as you

in fact, I am quite sure that the attempt will be a obscene quagmire

but i am interested to see what answers may arise

if you think that government administrative costs are lower than civilian, you are crazy

if you think that government graft and corruption will be less than civilian profit, you are deluded

"hope" -- Canada just pumped "stimulus" into their health care system b/c more hospitals are going bankrupt.

Medicare should serve as a window into how the U.S. will handle UHC -- it's 40 billion in debt and on its way to 20 Trillion (with a T) in debt in 50 years w/o

1. Reducing user benefits

2. Raising taxes

And as a sobering statistic, our small Medicare system runs at a price-tag 3x that of Canada's entire UHC system. Talk about inefficiencies and "profit" -- I wonder who's lining their pockets at taxpayer expense?

There are alternate solutions to our health care problems that address costs (the main problem) and that's what we should be concentrating on...not overhauling a great system in exchange of a system that's failing in real practice and putting it into the hands of an inept government.

If we had to design a plane:

Imagine we decided to go w/ the European design that had no problem getting up in to the air and as it flew along became heavier and heavier and harder to keep it airborne without shedding some weight and/or retooling it in mid-flight.

You'd expect we'd bypass that design and come up with something better that was more nimble and was able to maintain altitude indefinitely to get us from point A to point B w/o incident. Why should we treat a structured health care system any different?

Exchange the jet-engines for financial statements and statistical analysis...

______________________________________...

Edit:

I see few responses talking about "profits" -- what's your alternative? That we initiate a program that leads to:

1. Raising taxes indefinitely like we will w/ Medicare?

2. Reducing user benefits like we will w/ Medicare?

UHC is great on paper, but it's not "free"...and costs across the board are skyrocketing. It's simply not sustainable long term.

Is that the same thing as saying not everybody should have access to health care? No...it means the program doesn't work like it should and we shouldn't take on a losing template knowing that it'll cripple us in the long run.

Profit requires you compete -- competition requires you offer the lowest prices w/ the best quality.

And to be blunt, had people paid their bills in the first place and refrained from pursuing malpractice suits that were baseless we wouldn't be in this predicament -- paying for defaulted bills and malpractice insurance in our own premiums.

They plan to use the same tongue depressor to examine both oral and anal cavities of the body and feel one tongue depressor wiped-off can do anywhere between 50-100 different people....that is quite a savings in the long run and should add up fast in real medical equipment savings regarding 3 million people! Any more questions?

The only way for it to work would be to drop medical salaries. Doctors and nurses get paid far less in countries with socialized medicine (Canada, U.K., etc).

Currently America spends $2 trillion a year in health care.

Doctors in America make around $140,000 while doctors in England make $60,000.

U.S. salaries GP salary $139,000

http://www.payscale.com/research/US/People_with_Doctor_of_Medicine_(MD)_Degrees/Salary

United Kingdom GP salary $60,000 (40,000 Pounds)

http://www.payscale.com/research/Uk/People_with_Jobs_as_Physicians_%2f_Doctors/Salary

Canadian GP Salary $82,000 ($100,000 Canadian Dollars)

http://www.payscale.com/research/ca/People_with_Jobs_as_Physicians_%2f_Doctors/Salary

I don't think the gov't can make health care affordable to everyone. The government is turning into a welfare state. The gov't barrows trillions of dollars and I don't think we will ever be able to pay it back. I am really scared for our country. If we can't pay our bills we cut our spending. The gov't should do the same.

They could limit some of the absurd malpractice suits, that aren't really negligence at all on the part of the Doctor. No country's doctors get sued anywhere close to as much as ours.

In the end, this raises the malpractice insurance for all doctors, which raises the cost of health care as a whole.

What makes you think that after the government is able to lower health care costs by 20% that people who currently have none will even buy it? Many of those who are uninsured could easily afford to purchase health insurance if they put their priorities in place. Nothing will change.

NO.

They can't run a post office, the VA, Medicaid/care... and people want me to hand over my life to them???

Are you people freaking nuts?

And as a veteran, I can tell you about the fine military health care. It's GREAT as long as it's nothing major. Just don't get sick and you are fine.

It's not health care, it is insurance. That said, one possibility is that it is not for profit. However, most companies cover half the cost of private insurance. Would this stop with universal coverage?

What lower cost? He's spending over $600 Billion dollars on it. How the hell does that lower cost?

What can the government do? Lower wages of health care workers? Lower equipment costs? Lower the price to run a new drug through the FDA gauntlet?

I don't.

But...

It can insert rules that help economize.

Examples?

Digital Records

Fraud detection & prosecution

Waste detection & elimination

Competition where there is none.

Rewards for Efficiencies AS LONG AS CARE IS NOT ADVERSELY AFFECTED.

but I am just thinking out loud

I don't see what your problem is if we allow government to work side by side with private industry.

If you think it would be such an utter disaster, why do you seem afraid that it would run private companies out of business?

They can not make anything better or cheaper and they never have.

The goal of Government provided Universal healthcare along with Mandatory electronic medical records is to have access to every Americans Medical records and use them whenever they need to make people shut up or be denied service.

It is doable just take a look at the model set forth by Non Profit medical facilities, and the sliding scale system they use. In a sliding scale system many people have lower health care costs on the scale than their co-pay.

Our current federal government would not be incapable of doing it. However it could be done by a competent government that was not corrupt and controlled by corporate America.

Nobody makes a greater mistake than he who does nothing because he could only do a little. Something must be done because so many people are without health care, this situation is unacceptable in the greatest country in the world.

because they dont have to turn a profit

right now, our healtcare is run by insurance companies-and it is in their best interest NOT to provide service cause it increases profits

It will be a re-run of "Public Education:" a lot of good intentions - no good results.

They can't. The ignorant want free stuff, but their ignorance blinds them to the fact that they will pay many times over for anything the Government "gives" them

I'm sure they can, but the quality of care will drop tremendously. Long lines, crappy doctors.

it'll run as well as social security

We own the insurance industry now.

It cannot. Costs will be a minimum of 25% higher

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